Ever have the feeling that, while people sit in your congregation and attend your church, their hearts are really somewhere else? With someone else?
A recent post by the guys at the Pyromaniacs blog really sparked some thought in my mind about this very issue. While our folks come and participate in worship, they would rather be listening to the pastors they read and podcast. The popular guys. I’m sure you can fill in the names. The Pyro guys make a few good points in the post. Some controversial, mostly helpful.
On the issue of our people really having other pastors:
Now, some professed Christians sin outright, by never physically attending an actual, in-person church. We’ve talked about that, and they aren’t our focus.
But others do attend a church — physically. They come in, they sit down. They sing, they may give financially. They may look at you, Pastor, as you preach.
But you know their heart belongs to another.
Their real pastor isn’t you. It’s Dave Hunt. Or it’s John Piper. Or it’s John MacArthur, or Ligon Duncan, or Mark Dever, or David Cloud, or Joel Osteen. Or it’s Charles Spurgeon, or D. M. Lloyd-Jones, or J. C. Ryle. Or Calvin, or Luther, or Bahnsen, or de Mar, or R. B. Thieme, or J. Vernon McGee.
And they’re such better pastors than you are! You know they are!
Another good tidbit from the post was concerning the lack of commitment we really have to paper pastors. They likened it to pornography. We are in control of the relationship. We have a commitment we can leave at any time.
He came to see that he had no actual relationship with these women whatever. If (he named a female celebrity) had sat down next to him in an airplane, she wouldn’t know him from Adam. Whatever may have happened in his sinful fantasies, the two of them had no relationship in the real world….
And they’re right, in a way. They can’t compete with these women. Because these women don’t exist in the real world! They may not even look like their pictures! Thanks to computer wizardry, the pictures we see may actually bear only the slightest resemblance to the actual women……
And these paper pastors maintain the perfect distance. If you don’t want to hear something, they don’t press it — or you can instantly shut them up, snap! They never ask you to do something uncomfortable and follow up on you. They never persistently probe an area of sin, in you, in person, eyeball to eyeball… nor will they. Church discipline will not be a threat with them. Ever.
Because they don’t know you from Adam.
This blog post really intrigued me. Why? Because during my time at Southern Seminary, many of the guys I went to school with seemed to elevate certain pastors above Christ, all in the name of Christ. They idolized these men. They worshiped these pastors.
As a college pastor, I’ve seen some of our own students struggle with this issue (as have other church members for that matter). Some have more of a desire to discuss a podcasted sermon from one of the “paper pastors” than to wrestle with and apply our own pastor’s sermon.
Let me be clear: I love a good read. I love great sermons and resources, and I love the ministry of many of these paper pastors. I have benefitted greatly from them. I even cite them on this blog as well as recommend them to others often! They ARE great men of God.
But perspective is also very helpful.
While I find these pastors resourceful and appreciate their ministry, I wish that people would spend more time uplifting and encouraging their ACTUAL pastors rather than fashioning golden calfs.
They might find that they appreciate their pastor more than ever before. Even if their pastors aren’t quite as perfect in their eyes as McManus, Begg, Sproul, Stanley, Piper, or Driscoll.
Maybe I just needed to have a heart-to-heart with some of my seminary friends or college students that have seemed to struggle with this. I guess it’s never too late:
So, because it’s awkward for your pastor to say it to you — and because I’ve no church who’d suspect I’m talking to them, at the moment — I’ll just tell you plain:
Brother, sister: John Piper isn’t your pastor. John MacArthur knows nothing about you. Dave Hunt never got on his knees and prayed for you. Lloyd-Jones won’t come to your house when you’re recovering from surgery, or one of your children shatters your heart, or your marriage is shaking and rocking and barely hanging on. Charles Spurgeon won’t weep with you as you weep.
Read the original post at the Pyromaniacs blog here.
HT: Sergio Mendoza
3 Comments
Maybe, the only thing that matters is whether or not your congregation is growing into the image of Christ…or not. After all, some plant; some water; but God gives the increase.
Larry,
I completely agree with you. My greater concern is not with the person who utilizes these resources and desires to grow through their teachings, and yet remains humble.
That is what I personally strive for!
My concern is with the idolatry that seems to take place, and the unteachable spirit that many people seem to have once they get hooked on a certain pastor’s sermons/resources.
Thanks for the comment!
Like you I find many of the broadcast evangelists to be a good resource for more study. I even refer people to books by some of them when they have questions on a subject the evangelist specializes in.(LaHaye and Hagee on prophecy) The biggest danger I see is one they pyro guys mentioned addressing in an earlier post. Forsaking the fellowship of the saints.
My brother-in-law suffers from PTSD after tours in Afghanistan and Iraq. Crowds are not something he handles well. Unfortunately that is an excuse for him and my sister to say “Joyce Meyer is my pastor”. While I like Joyce’s teaching and her ministry is what led my sister back to the word and to the Lord, My sister has never even seen her teach in person. I’m sure, given the size of her church, many of the people who are in Joyce’s congregation name one of the ministry pastors as their pastor just as many young people would name their youth pastor. They just don’t know the Senior pastor that well.
I’m the worship leader at a small SBC church just 2 blocks from my sisters house and I invite her regularly. A church built to hold around 200 and currently getting around 40 loving and supportive Christians in Sunday School, seems to me the perfect environment to get used to being around people. The crowds not to big, they’re understanding and supportive, there’s plenty of room to find breathing space when your uncomfortable, and still my sibling and her husband prefer the TV.
I must admit that politics tends to play some part. It’s easier to dismiss the politically incorrect message of a pastor if you never hear it. Such messages are hard to avoid in the pew. My church is staunchly Christian Conservative preferring to make the bible a guide for proper living rather than the whims of legislature and courts. Many in my family have parted with strong churches because they couldn’t justify their political views in church. Most sought out and found churches that water down the message, either because of wimpy pastors or a national organization that bends to votes instead of prayer. Some prefer the TV and others quit going altogether. The only honest ones are the Catholics who attend church then tell everyone they disagree with the church on certain points but they still love Jesus.
There are a few “televangelists” who refuse to shy away from the word as written and in total, I recommend their books and sermons when people need in depth study of some subjects. Many others, including some mentioned in your blog, are to politically correct even to stand up for the gospels message of the only way to heaven, and those who heard about a certain Larry King interview know who I am talking about. People have asked me if those preachers are wrong about everything. I tell them the truth, I used to watch them regularly and found most of their doctrine sound but, I won’t waste my time on any teacher who can’t stand up for his beliefs. Anything a person learns from them should be examined carefully, compared to scripture and questions asked of a solid, bible believing, pastor who doesn’t shy away from the truth under pressure.
In closing I must say, that the same tests I advocate for “paper pastors” should be applied to the one in your local church as well. I have known good people, I respected, with great backgrounds who preached garbage from the pulpit. I love them but, they were dead wrong and I’m glad they are out of the ministry now. If a person takes a verse out of context to prove a point the verse didn’t make, they are wrong. Even if the point they made was valid their tactic comes from “the father of lies”. When they won’t stand up for their beliefs under pressure, they can’t be trusted. When they mold their teaching to fit their politics instead of the other way around, they are committing evil.
Remember to never forsake the fellowship of the saints even if you have to find them and bring them to your house for bible study because there are no good churches available. That was the way of the first century church and it will be the way of the last century church, according to the bible. My God Bless and keep you,
Carl